Melissa Lapin (00:08.488)
Hey everybody, welcome to this episode of After the Well. I'm glad you joined me. If this is your first time, welcome. If it's not your first time, welcome back and thank you just for being here. Today, I get to talk to my fairly new friend, Jennifer Tate. We are in a program called... Oh my God, I just... That's hilarious.
Jennifer Tate (00:33.736)
HAHAHAHA
Melissa Lapin (00:37.444)
Kingdom Leadership Matrix, KLM. And it's a women's, it's a program for women and leadership and it deals a lot with just healing our own hearts and learning how to lead from a place of vulnerability and honesty and with ourselves and humility and all the things that it takes to be a good leader, not just a people manager. So there you go. So we met.
Jennifer Tate (00:40.256)
Ugh.
Jennifer Tate (01:04.246)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (01:06.544)
I don't know, probably January-ish of this year when I joined, January, February, you know, we've had some different conversations and you've taught several mastermind classes over different subjects and stuff like that. And I just think you're a neat person and I wanted to have you on here just to chit chat about how you got to be so awesome. And I just, you know, and just to hear a little bit more of your story.
Jennifer Tate (01:31.326)
Aww.
Melissa Lapin (01:36.1)
And because I love that you were a nurse, I love that you guys sell guns and because gods and guns go together, right? But you're in Bryan, Texas, and you can take it from there. Just tell us a little bit about yourself.
Jennifer Tate (01:46.026)
Yeah, right?
Jennifer Tate (01:57.558)
Yeah, well, thanks for having me on. I appreciate this opportunity. And I just love to get to know people better as well. And we are, we're located in Bryan, Texas. We moved here, oh my gosh, it's gonna be almost three years, I think, and from Missouri. We were lifetime Missouri people born and raised, Kansas City, Missouri area. And I just didn't grow up in religion, didn't grow up in church, none of that.
Melissa Lapin (01:59.943)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (02:23.558)
Actually, I wrote a book. It's you know, my testimony is in the book. It's called roaring kingdom truths over wilderness lies and Yeah, roaring kingdom truths over wilderness lies. Yeah, basically
Melissa Lapin (02:29.776)
I did not know that. Wait, what's it called?
Melissa Lapin (02:35.54)
Okay, which everybody listening, that will be in the show notes so you can order that.
Jennifer Tate (02:40.894)
Yeah, and I think it's like, when I released it, I didn't promote it. So I think it's like way cheapo. So you can get it for like nothing because Amazon's like, thank you. But with that being said, you know, yeah, it's just part of my story. But basically it is my testimony because I spoke at a women's event and, you know, was sharing and they were all like, oh, we need your notes. We need, you know, what you have. And, you know, I had heard if you write a book, you can be in multiple places at one time. And so.
Melissa Lapin (02:48.611)
Well, we're gonna change that!
Jennifer Tate (03:10.73)
you know, and then I feel prompted by the Holy Spirit, write the book. So I wrote the book out of obedience and really just so it could reach more women. And really, I was, like I said, born in Kansas City. My mom was a drug dealer. And so I have some, you know, brief stories in there. And there's not a lot of detail in the book. It was intentionally that way, but really the preface of it.
Melissa Lapin (03:25.992)
What? Okay.
Jennifer Tate (03:33.878)
Like half of the book is a journal where it helps you take your thoughts captive. What do you do with that? What does that even mean? Right. And so this process in that I utilized in the journey to break free from all of the, I would say, junk in our trunk, all the things the world put on us, all the the, you know, I'm a survivor of sexual abuse, physical abuse, mental abuse. My mom was a drug dealer. I was in, you know, not good environments as a kid. She did the best she knew how to do as a teenage mom. But, you know, how do you walk in life?
Melissa Lapin (03:39.528)
Hmm.
Melissa Lapin (03:53.566)
Wow.
Jennifer Tate (04:02.442)
that way without being bitter, offensive, hateful, you know, taking on all those names and that are put on you. You know, and I talked about that, you know, as far as being unwanted or unworthy or, you know, you were a mistake or just whatever it is or was. And so, yeah.
Melissa Lapin (04:07.86)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (04:20.388)
Well, okay, here's, yeah. That's interesting. And I may have heard you tell a little bit of this story before, but what you just said aligns so well with Fettini's story, which that's the name of the woman at the well, because you said, you know, all these things put on her and the names put on her and things said about her and whatever, like.
There's zero history of her until she has that encounter with Jesus. But everyone, the messages that we hear about her all say that she was a prostitute. She was all of these things. She wasn't.
There is zero history of that. She was married five times. That doesn't make her a prostitute. You know and so in her own walking that out and choosing to believe what Jesus said about her comes through all the noise of all the things put on her by people.
Jennifer Tate (05:31.622)
Right. Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (05:31.736)
You know, and you said before we actually got on, you talked about you didn't grow up in a faith-based household, you know? And so surviving in that and not being bitter, and yeah, so hijack that a little bit, but go ahead, go back. Go ahead. Just.
Jennifer Tate (05:39.618)
Mm-mm. Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (05:49.842)
No, that's good. Yeah. And you know, that was hard because really, I met someone in high school and who invited me to church and that's where, you know, really it was a social club for me. It was more than it was going to church to have that relationship with the Lord. Like it wasn't about that. And so, you know, and I got saved because who doesn't want to go to hell, right? Like that was the message. Get saved or you're going to hell. And so it's like, yeah, I want to be saved. But I didn't know what that meant. And it didn't mean relationship with the Lord.
Melissa Lapin (06:01.587)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (06:07.732)
Hmph.
Right?
Jennifer Tate (06:19.362)
by any means, you know, that's not what they were really teaching. And just because they were, they were, I believe a lot of churches just do what they know how to do and that's it, you know? And so unless you've got somebody who's going to break out of the box, somebody that's going to, you know, press in and have that relationship with the Lord and then share it with others in the relationship they have with Him, with them, you know, that freedom.
Melissa Lapin (06:23.162)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (06:28.018)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (06:41.694)
in those environments doesn't come. But with that being said, so back I was 15, got saved, and I just felt like the blessing of the Lord, he always protected me. I could see all the way back, I was under a table as a little itty bitty with a gun point at my mom's head. I can see like, oh, Angel, things being, that's what that was, an angel was protecting us, and I had a little sister, and so.
Melissa Lapin (06:56.617)
Wow.
Melissa Lapin (07:03.048)
Hmm.
Jennifer Tate (07:04.534)
get going through all of that. But then as a teenager, you know, I got saved, but then, like I said, it was really more of a social club and really I did the party things, I did the thing, you know, I was running, I was not living any type of relationship life whatsoever, yeah.
Melissa Lapin (07:11.644)
Ha ha
Melissa Lapin (07:20.944)
get it. Like literally, okay, so like my dad died when I was 15. Up until then, you know, so for 15 years, there was no God. I mean, they weren't anti God just wasn't a thing. You know, church wasn't a thing or whatever. I went to vacation Bible school with my at my grandma's during the summer for a while. But again, that's just hey, let's do crafts with the little old ladies that teach the Bible class. Right?
Jennifer Tate (07:47.282)
Yeah, right.
Melissa Lapin (07:49.276)
But when my dad died when I was 15, some friend, I don't know who these people were, never saw these people before, but all of a sudden they showed up in our life. But I guess they were a friend of my mom's or something. And they started taking us to church and I went to church. But girl, that-
kids that I went to church with were the same kids that I sell weed to on the weekends, you know? So I'm just like, why am I gonna play these games? Why do I have to go here, do all these things to have pizza once a month? And you know, kinda, I just, yeah, so it's crazy. Ha ha.
Jennifer Tate (08:11.238)
Yeah, yeah, that's exactly. Yeah, right.
Jennifer Tate (08:23.274)
Right, right, yeah. Yeah, and the back of the bus stories when they go to the event, you know, all that stuff. And I was just like, honestly, I'm gonna have to say, I feel like I was a little mortified. I was like, whoa, wait, how is this different than the typical high school crowd, you know? And so anyways, but yeah, going through life, it's just, I can see how the Lord's hand has been on my life. I had my babies, well, I dated my husband four or five years at the time, and then we got married, had...
Melissa Lapin (08:36.588)
Exactly! Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (08:51.478)
had twins, they were born at 24 weeks, they weigh a pound 12 and a pound 13, they were as big as my hand, yeah, and teeny tiny burritos, yeah, and we called them little peanuts, and you know, the Lord, everything the doctor spoke over them did not come to be, and so it's just been, you know, I've been extremely blessed, but you know.
Melissa Lapin (08:54.264)
Oh gosh. What a burrito! He had baby burritos. Ha ha ha.
Jennifer Tate (09:12.982)
But yeah, I ran around with the crowd, the girls that were not so nice girls, but I got those labels too because I was their friend. But really, I wasn't doing the same things, but I was in the environment. And then there were times I did do the same things, right? And so it was just like, oh, that relationship wasn't there. So then...
You know, I found a church, I always feel like the Lord's like, go here, go here. I feel like I go where I'm called to serve. I'm a servant leader by heart. And so it's like, I'm not here for what you're going to give me. I'm here to serve. And in that serving, hearts change. You meet people. And then you can share, you know, truths. And so, but as far as, yeah, that goes, it...
Melissa Lapin (09:38.312)
sure.
Melissa Lapin (09:44.029)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (09:55.634)
It's funny though because I was 20, 21 and my ex-husband, he rodeo'd all the time. And we would go to rodeos three hours away. Then I am a very dedicated person of my word. Like if I say I'm gonna do it, I do it. I was teaching three and four year olds in Sunday school.
Melissa Lapin (10:02.658)
Sweet.
Jennifer Tate (10:16.598)
So I would get up at like 5 a.m. and drive all the way back home three hours to teach Children's Church after I'd been up drinking that night. Like it was not like it but they put me in these positions, you know, just I get pulled up to these leadership positions and then they'd asked if I wanted to be a deacon and I didn't even know what that meant. And I'm like, wait a minute. I'm seeing like I wasn't even married at that time. And it was just a it's just crazy. But you know, the walk with the Lord is just
Melissa Lapin (10:36.148)
Ha ha ha.
Melissa Lapin (10:41.213)
Bye.
Jennifer Tate (10:46.786)
just amazing and yeah.
Melissa Lapin (10:49.708)
So, so you said, you know, obviously you didn't grow up with God being a big factor in your home. What do you think an early well moment was maybe that where?
Even if you couldn't put words to it, where do you think Jesus showed up for you? I mean, obviously you said you were under a table with your sister while your mom was being held at gunpoint. So there's that, but did that register that, oh, there's something bigger out there than me? Like, like universe, and I'm using air quotes.
Jennifer Tate (11:11.179)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (11:15.255)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (11:24.65)
You know, I don't think so. Yeah, yeah, I don't think so. Not that in that moment. You know, and as far as like, oh, I really didn't even, when we had all the miracles with the babies, one had a trach and a feeding tube, and you know, they had said neither one would live and all the things. And even then I would say I still didn't, I was just like.
Melissa Lapin (11:41.044)
Hmm.
Jennifer Tate (11:45.518)
trusting, like whatever is going to happen, the Lord was in control and it's going to happen. I couldn't freak out completely. But when I was, the girls, we couldn't go to church because of the trach and the feeding tube and they were preemies and they could get sick. So they got shots every week and a nurse came to our house and I had a nurse that helped me. But even with that, until they, let's see, they, when they were three, we got the trach out about three and a half to four, we could go to church. And so
I took them to a church that was just up in the corner close to our house that a neighbor went to. And I had a moment where, I don't even remember what the sermon was, but it was one of those Holy Spirit moments. And I think this is definitely a well moment for me where it's like the Lord met me where I was and showed me I've been here throughout all this time, look at all these miracles. And I was like, I wanna rededicate my life. And so I went forward because I...
Melissa Lapin (12:29.428)
Hmm.
Jennifer Tate (12:40.642)
I'm like, I want to be rebaptized because I was baptized at 15. I'm like, I want to rededicate. Like this is a heart movement. Like this has truly, the Lord has truly penetrated my heart, my soul, my entire being. And it's comical because that pastor was like, well, you don't have to be rebaptized, but here now you're a member of the church. And I'm like,
Melissa Lapin (12:46.973)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (13:02.494)
I wasn't saying I wanted to be a member of the church. I wanted to read, like rededicate, because I felt that transitional moment, you know, with the Lord. And so I became a church member. Well, then I became like leadership, a pillar of the leadership. And I know over all of children's ministry and like all the things. And so we did that for, you know, a decade or so, but it was just like, wow. So to me, that was like a first.
Melissa Lapin (13:05.928)
Tag on!
Melissa Lapin (13:18.244)
You were qualified!
Melissa Lapin (13:23.101)
Wow.
Jennifer Tate (13:32.062)
micro moment of, whoa, like this move from head knowledge to heart knowledge, like it became part of my cellular being. Like my cells came alive, you know, like, oh, this is who, like there's more, you know, and my eyes opened. I always say, I believe people are walking around asleep. And so we're just here to wake them up to who the Lord created them to be, you know? Hey, remember, you chose to come here. Like he knew you before he formed the earth and you gave your yes, you've always had free will. So here we are.
Melissa Lapin (13:53.332)
Mm-hmm.
Jennifer Tate (14:01.478)
and you know just help people figure that out but Yeah, and so that journey and then um I'm trying to think I do remember thinking I was 34 because I remember thinking. Oh man. Jesus was 33 Why couldn't this have happened last year?
Melissa Lapin (14:19.272)
That's, you know, and we do that. And so if anyone out there is listening who is over 33, there's still opportunity, you know, because that was one of my struggles. And I talked about it in one of my output videos that I just did about that becoming a Christian or dedicated, because I met Jesus when I was 20.
Jennifer Tate (14:26.717)
Ehh!
Jennifer Tate (14:30.796)
Right?
Jennifer Tate (14:46.09)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (14:46.6)
I became a Christian when I was 20. I met Jesus when I was 40, right? Because you just play all the games until you have that well moment, until you have that aha moment of you understand your identity, your purpose, your position is huge. And until you understand that,
Jennifer Tate (14:51.538)
Yeah. Right.
Jennifer Tate (15:06.078)
Yeah, yeah.
Melissa Lapin (15:10.02)
we almost kind of live our lives behind the eight ball, you know, that like we can't win, that we always owe God something. And for me, it wasn't of like, not, oh God, something from the perspective of, I have to earn, you know, I owe him everything because he loves me, right? Because a lot of people do that and it's works and all of that. But for me, it was, oh man, all this time I have missed out on.
Jennifer Tate (15:31.274)
Right. Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (15:40.34)
And so then there's all this extra stuff that I put on myself that he never did because I feel guilty for not getting saved sooner. And you know, so it's like, no, people just start where you are. If you're over 33, it's fine. There's no judgment from anybody. If there is, get new friends because Jesus sure ain't judging you. You know, just pick up the ball on that.
Jennifer Tate (15:52.074)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (16:03.336)
Right. Exactly, yeah.
Melissa Lapin (16:08.808)
40 yard line, 50 yard line, 60 yard line, wherever you are and just run, just go. So.
Jennifer Tate (16:15.174)
Yeah, yeah, I love it. Yeah. So definitely. Yeah, experiencing that, that heart, that, you know, cellular, cellular awakening to who you truly are, right? And then the power and the authority that comes with that, but as a responsibility as well, you know, it's like, oh,
to walk around and act like you don't know who you, when we get trapped in that, I hate to see people, hate to see people like that. I'm one of those people, pick up your mat and let's go. We're doing this or I'm on. And so that is really...
Melissa Lapin (16:39.88)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (16:46.233)
Right? Right.
Melissa Lapin (16:52.604)
Yeah, yeah, but it's taught, you know, well, you're a sinner safe by grace. Well, if our focus is always being a sinner, then you're not gonna understand grace. You know? And so people don't know how to pick up their mat because our sad Western theology
Jennifer Tate (16:54.091)
Kinda harsh.
Jennifer Tate (17:04.03)
Right, right, yeah.
Melissa Lapin (17:12.816)
tells us that we're nothing but dirty sinners, we're pond scum, we're all of these things but for the grace of God. And like, okay, well, grace says pick your mouth up and walk. You know?
Jennifer Tate (17:17.111)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (17:24.958)
Yeah, yeah, you know, I feel like that's where I was protected from that is because I guess I just never really identified With that as far as i'm just like no, this is who this is who I am His he took care of it like he took care of it He doesn't have to die on the cross 50 times over he took care of it. And so um, you know, and I am I
Melissa Lapin (17:36.157)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (17:43.186)
Right?
Jennifer Tate (17:47.474)
I do, I am a servant leader and I did have to break free from some codependency type things too of I will help you pick your mat up, I will help you take the first couple steps. But there is a point where now you've got to do it yourself, you have to want it yourself, you have to walk it yourself. And that was part of my, I think my second whale moment would be, you know,
Melissa Lapin (17:54.17)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (17:59.336)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (18:04.904)
Yep.
Jennifer Tate (18:15.958)
I don't even know, I was after 40, but my things were just off in my life and you know, I had asked, I just kept asking my husband at the time, I'm like, what is, like something's off, something's wrong. He's like, no, everything's fine, we're fine, you're fine, like everything's fine. And he just kept saying that over and over. And you know, I want to say it probably went on for a couple years and I even called some things out and then, but no, everything was fine. And you know, I had a therapist at the time.
Melissa Lapin (18:30.78)
Ha.
Jennifer Tate (18:45.258)
Because of all the stuff in the past, I learned therapists are important, pivotal people in your life that can help you work through things. My therapist is like, you are passive suicidal. That is passive suicidal, what you're saying to me. I was like, what? I just didn't, if I existed, I existed. If I didn't, I didn't. The world would go on without me. It just got to that point.
Melissa Lapin (18:51.014)
Uh huh.
Melissa Lapin (19:00.45)
Interesting.
Melissa Lapin (19:09.043)
Wow.
Jennifer Tate (19:10.534)
Yeah, and so one night finally my husband came home and told me he'd been having an affair and he was still having an affair and that's what is going on. And so my life completely, I really did not think that was happening, flipped upside down. And so I would say that was my second ultimate come to the well moment. That moment of what? Just sesame, just the moment in the garden. The Garden of G with God.
Melissa Lapin (19:16.617)
Hmm.
Melissa Lapin (19:34.493)
The garden. We're just gonna cut the garden.
Jennifer Tate (19:40.898)
But it was that you know that moment at the well where it's like father you know who I am You've told me you are I am your bride like you are we have that relationship. You've always left me You've never forsaken me, but I literally was that snotty crying on the floor your will be done This is what I want and you know my heart's desires But I know that you know, we all have free will and we have to accept that so moving into that next season Based no matter what
decisions were made by other people or what other people said, for me was very, very powerful. And I dove a lot into identity with that. And who am I truly? Who did he truly create me to be? And the freedom in that so that I could then stand in that. And as a nurse, you know, I...
I've been known to pray and we see people healed. And so there's so many testimonies to all of that. But it was like, what does that look like though in this season and pressing into the power of our words and the power of who he created us to be. As we have that relationship with him and hearing him and knowing, okay, wait, this is what the world's saying. This is what, you know, everybody's like, burn his crap, do this, throw it out. And I'm just like, yeah. And I'm like, that's just not what.
Melissa Lapin (20:45.428)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (20:56.632)
Mm-hmm. Be vindictive and yeah.
Jennifer Tate (21:02.25)
the heart of the Lord, you know? And there are so many verses that go with that.
Melissa Lapin (21:03.685)
Right?
Yeah, so in that, and you can get as personal as you want, what were some of the things that the Lord told you? Because we can cry out and sometimes, OK, so here's a teaching moment, I guess. There are so many times that we get into situations, whatever it is, relationship, finances, health, whatever, and
we are snot crying on the floor, you know, and shit's real. Life is real. It is, this is really happening to me. I know what scripture says, but the reality is this is happening to me, you know, and we pour our guts out.
Jennifer Tate (21:38.708)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (21:47.842)
Mm-hmm.
Jennifer Tate (21:52.063)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (21:56.836)
we get real with God, which a lot of people don't think they can do. So, y'all, if you want to like, I've cussed at God. He is I am still here. He did not strike me with lightning. Right. So, I mean, like he knows it all anyway. We're the ones that are stubborn about it. But so do what you need to do. Beat a tree, scream at the sky, all the things. So when we do that.
Jennifer Tate (22:01.303)
Mm-hmm.
Jennifer Tate (22:07.678)
He knows it all.
Melissa Lapin (22:24.492)
And yet we then we don't hear anything. So was how.
Jennifer Tate (22:27.593)
Mmm, yeah.
Melissa Lapin (22:33.704)
Did that happen for you?
Did you hear things or did you not hear things? I mean, did you feel just a peace in your heart to move forward? Because that's how a lot of times I think we get stuck in our relationship with God thinking, he doesn't care, he doesn't hear us, you know, like God, where are you? Don't you see what's happening? And he's like, yeah, I do. You know, if you would calm down a minute, we could get through this. And it's not always audible. There is sometimes that just peace that passes,
and trusting that peace and in that for me going through transitions or hard things I don't work outside the home and I haven't since 1999 which is it seems eternity ago at this point you know so it hasn't been you know changing jobs and the questions of that I've been married for
Jennifer Tate (23:06.647)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (23:35.634)
relationship is good I'm not questioning any of that but at some point we have to trust ourselves in the work that God has done in us whether we hear him physically say anything or not you know we have to look for that peace at the very least you know
Jennifer Tate (23:50.778)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (24:01.46)
and trust that is his communication to us. You know, I think we do ourself a disservice when we're constantly looking for writing on the wall or some big supernatural sign or, you know, Ed McMahon showing up at our door, you know, with a big check or winning the Powerball and, you know, all the external answers.
Jennifer Tate (24:06.509)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (24:26.024)
when it's literally, okay, God, this is what I know, this is what I'm going to move forward in because right now, this is my truth until you show me differently.
Jennifer Tate (24:38.122)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (24:38.768)
You know, so was there any of that? Because that's devastating. I am so thankful that just, I've never been in a relationship like that, like divorce. I hate divorce. Divorce is horrible because there's betrayal, there's all the questions, all the things, right? So I am landing my plane, but... I...
Jennifer Tate (24:50.942)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (24:56.991)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (25:01.383)
Hahaha, yeah.
Melissa Lapin (25:03.856)
Because it just triggered something in me when we get into these situations and we don't trust ourselves and then we blame God for not showing up. So in that, not saying that's what you did, but what were some of your takeaways in that you could stand on, your well moments? Because like she knew that God, that Jesus...
Jennifer Tate (25:16.138)
Mmm.
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (25:30.136)
even when she walked away from that well, she knew that Jesus still knew her, right? And so it was a really long way to ask that question, but were there, what were the nuggets that when you got up, when you were done snot crying on the floor, what were they that helped you?
Jennifer Tate (25:35.158)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (25:41.639)
HAHA
Melissa Lapin (25:52.464)
continue going since you already said that you know you were passive suicidal which I'm sure you were just picking up physically what he was putting down because if he was doing that There's all kinds of stuff happening in the atmosphere and not to get all spooky and whatever But yeah
Jennifer Tate (26:01.515)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (26:07.742)
Oh, yeah. Oh, no. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Honestly, my reply at the time was, I am not crazy. Oh my gosh. I'm not crazy. All the things. I'm a discerner. I'm a knower. And so those are my guests. I'm a discerner. I'm a knower. I mean, I'm a seer. I'm a hear. I'm a smell. Like I experienced them all. But you know, I'm really strong, though. discerner and
Melissa Lapin (26:19.196)
Thank you! Thank you!
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (26:29.799)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (26:34.806)
I kept saying something's up, you know, and to be told, no, everything's fine. You're, you know, it's like, wait, no, something. I mean, there's so much to that story. But, you know, I was like, I am not crazy. So anyways, though, but past that, though, that that's not a crying moment. You know, I just as you were talking, I was hearing, you know, the Lord showed me there's power in the pause. Like we want it now. We want it solution. We want things to go back to the way that they're supposed to be. And I had to break free from that, that religious.
Melissa Lapin (26:39.016)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (26:43.024)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (26:55.46)
Yes.
Jennifer Tate (27:03.23)
Innuasion that you cannot get Divorced like it's not okay to get divorced it you can't you can't get divorced and it's not okay And so you know I had to go through that process and the Lord took me through I did this thing I started this thing called two chairs There's a book called two chairs Bodine I think is the author but anyways Basically, I had a chair and two chairs and I would sit in the chair every morning with the Lord even if I didn't want to for five minutes
Melissa Lapin (27:07.829)
Aw, come on. Come on.
Melissa Lapin (27:29.713)
Mm-hmm.
Jennifer Tate (27:30.582)
before I started my day, the Lord was in a chair and I was in a chair and I'm like, all right, Lord, you know, just cry or play some worship music or Lord, what do you wanna say to me today? And I've got my Bible and I open it and he's like right here. And he took me through this journey and I journaled it all of where it was okay. It was okay to let go. It was okay. He was with me, you know, and even if it doesn't look like what I think it should look like, how...
Melissa Lapin (27:36.038)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (27:50.457)
Mm-hmm.
Jennifer Tate (27:57.698)
He took me through this path of forgiving myself of my expectations I placed on there. Forgiving myself as, you know, as well as forgiving him and the other person as well, but forgiving myself and forgiving it all and giving it all to him. Like I literally had to lay it all at the cross. Like I literally had to hand it over and not pick it back up. And don't get me wrong, there are times where I tried to pick the pieces back up and put it all back together. And he's like, nope, like you keep moving forward. So yeah, it's just.
Melissa Lapin (28:14.073)
Mmm.
Jennifer Tate (28:27.146)
I'd say power in the pause of just trusting and believing. I'm a very heavy, heavy faith-based person. Like even though I don't see it, I believe it and you can try to prove it wrong, but I still believe it if the Lord said it. And so trusting him in the process and having that peace that passes understanding, that's one thing I went to a group called Divorce Care. And it was like, there were people there that had been there for three years. And I'm like, people, you are not moving.
Melissa Lapin (28:36.116)
Mm-hmm.
Jennifer Tate (28:55.626)
You're not moving into and then they kind of clung to me because I came in with a strong identity Like I said, I don't earlier I dove into the identity of who he created in me. Who am I? I need to become a healthy whole individual myself. My husband needs to help be a healthy whole individual Himself and when we come together, it's two holes coming together to make a greater, you know existence of the Lord. It's not Two halves coming together. Please make me whole and so
Melissa Lapin (29:09.745)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (29:13.468)
Come on, yeah.
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (29:22.436)
Right, it's not 50-50. Yeah, it's 100-100, yeah.
Jennifer Tate (29:24.826)
No, no. Yeah. And so really, I think that was a PowerPoint was identifying, okay, let me work on, and I even said that hit that to him, you work on who you are supposed to be, I'm going to work on myself. Well, let's work on it together. And that was an option that he chose not to have. And so, you know, and so I had to accept that though, and, and believe that the Lord
One of my verses that I clung to was Jeremiah 29, 11. I know the plans I have for you, declares the Lord. They're plans for prosperity, for abundance. It's not for harm. Your future days are greater than your latter days. And those are the type of things where it's like, that's his promise. I believe that. I'm going to stand on that. I know he's got better planned for me, even though I think I knew what it was. It's going to look different. And so.
Melissa Lapin (29:57.242)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (30:11.906)
Just standing in that was pivotal for me and it gave me a piece that I could cling to. It's like, yeah, I don't know what it means, but taking that next step. You know, and I would have to say having people in your life because you lose a lot of friends when you have something like that happen. I think any traumatic event in your life, you will see people who show up and you will see people who fizzle out. And you know, so be it. Yeah, or two sides.
Melissa Lapin (30:17.944)
Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (30:26.924)
Yes. Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (30:34.48)
Mm-hmm. Or choose sides. Yeah, they'll choose sides. Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (30:40.326)
And so it's hard. It was kind of hard because the secretiveness of what was happening. I look like I'm the bad person because well, wait, you your wife left and now wait, now she's divorcing you. And now wait, now she's getting remarried. It looks like I was the person. And so, you know, but to not worry about what people think. I mean, that was a key as well as just like I can't worry about what people think. I know what the Lord thinks about me and I have to step into that. And so.
Melissa Lapin (30:58.278)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (31:06.461)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (31:10.266)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (31:10.87)
It gave me the ability to do that. But having people in your life that can, like when your mind is not in alignment with the truths of having, when it's like the swirls going on and they could be, and you can call them and be like, hey, hey Melissa, I'm thinking this right now, could you just help me? And you just pull me back into alignment, I think, is really key to have one or two people in your life that can do that for you. Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (31:20.004)
Yeah. For sure.
Melissa Lapin (31:28.184)
Uh huh. Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (31:32.72)
Yeah, just healthy community, absolutely, to bring you balance. Girl, you've been crazy, so back up from the cliff and let's just say, let's go for coffee, you know? Yeah, and that's hard nowadays, especially, I don't know, people just get too busy or whatever, you know, we just left our church.
Jennifer Tate (31:40.788)
Yeah.
Right?
Melissa Lapin (31:54.685)
like a month ago, five weeks ago, something. And I saw someone the week after our last Sunday there. And I made a comment about, you know, not seeing, you know, people just don't reach out, people.
I mean, to this day, five weeks later, we've had two people reach out and they were like two people that I would never have thought would have reached out, right, which was really cool. And they were both men, which was interesting. But this person, my friend, she said, well, Sundays just makes it easy to be friends and the rest of the time it's just out of sight, out of mind. And if you need me to just text you or whatever, it's just not gonna happen.
Jennifer Tate (32:19.83)
Hmm. Yeah.
Hmm.
Melissa Lapin (32:40.656)
And I'm like, oh, okay, let's just, let's move you to an outer circle and we'll Danny silk your butt right away, right? You know, and just move on. You're out there with a lot of other people, you know? And it's sad that we do that, that it has to be convenient for us to be community with somebody.
Jennifer Tate (32:41.531)
Oh wow.
Jennifer Tate (32:51.285)
Right?
Melissa Lapin (33:04.804)
I'm not saying you got to drive an hour across town to, you know, have dinner, you know, that kind of thing. But a freaking phone call and a text message when I see you on Facebook all the time? Girl, that's just not right. You know? That rant. Sorry, y'all. Not sorry, but.
Jennifer Tate (33:06.168)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (33:19.871)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it's true though. It is true. That's what I always look for too at churches is that relationship. Are people legit about relationship? And I'll be honest, I'm a bad connector person. I just am. I have to really work at it.
Melissa Lapin (33:34.227)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (33:42.018)
But you do work at it. Yeah. Yes, yes.
Jennifer Tate (33:44.23)
I do and I also am a substance person. So I mean, I don't know. I say that but then I'll do a stupid call and be like, girl, you should try this ice cream. And so I say substance, maybe it's food substance. But anyways, but yeah, it's just, I don't know.
Melissa Lapin (33:59.969)
Right? It is.
Melissa Lapin (34:06.908)
It is community. Community is very important, important with the, you know, going through the relationship transitions and stuff like that. Uh, you know, and something you said and just, dad gum dogs, sorry if everybody heard it. Um, the woman at the well, you talked about forgiving yourself, you know, and it's like, at what, at some point,
Jennifer Tate (34:22.861)
Hahaha
Jennifer Tate (34:27.298)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (34:30.092)
after five marriages, right? Because she had five husbands and she wasn't Jewish. So the Jewish culture was, you know, the brother had to marry the widow, the brother had to marry the widow, you know, and that. So that's five kind of thing. And then the guy she was with wasn't her husband. So at some point after that fifth guy, did they run out of? Ha ha ha.
that they run out of brothers, but also she was Samaritan culture and I've come to find out that Samaritans were okay with divorce so Were they not five brothers? You know, I mean just all those things and then this guy after a point
Jennifer Tate (34:53.309)
hahahaha
Jennifer Tate (35:06.89)
Yeah. Well, and did they were they all alive? Did some of them die? Was that a different check in the Bible? Like I felt like there was somebody who had like three husbands that died. Oh, it was somebody else. It was. Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (35:11.508)
Which... yeah, uh... there was.
Melissa Lapin (35:19.)
Yeah, yeah, because we are like literally we know zero, nothing about the woman at the well, nothing. Um, and but she was living with a guy. So A, five husbands, she was probably up in age just guessing, you know, unless they all died like real close to each other. But the, the um, the point I was trying to make because I-
Jennifer Tate (35:25.278)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (35:35.606)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (35:47.184)
rabbit, let's shoot the rabbit, um, was I got to thinking about did she, did she have to forgive herself?
Jennifer Tate (35:48.758)
Bye guys!
Jennifer Tate (35:57.927)
I love it. Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (35:58.012)
For what? You know, because like what you talked about, because we do, we have to forgive ourselves. We hold ourselves hostage so much for all kinds of silly things and petty things. We hold ourselves hostage to that Jesus is like, I don't remember that. And we keep reminding him that we did these things when the cross took care of it all and we keep throwing it in his face. But, you know, when we go through these things, like divorce, especially with, you know,
Jennifer Tate (36:04.152)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (36:08.78)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (36:14.099)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (36:17.758)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (36:28.206)
It's just, you're a bad person, no one, you know, just all the negative thoughts that the rejection from all kinds of places, you know?
Jennifer Tate (36:32.136)
Oh yeah, yeah.
Jennifer Tate (36:36.63)
Yeah, and I think that's the key is Jesus says, I didn't put that on you. Like, I didn't say that about you. I don't say that about you. Wait a minute. Remember when you gave your life to me? I already took care of it. It's washed away. I don't even know what you're talking about.
Melissa Lapin (36:44.884)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (36:50.601)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (36:54.172)
Well, it goes all the way back to the garden. Who told you? You know? Because even way back then, the first guy written about, Adam, was, you know, he tried to play that game and God is like, who told you that? You know? Because before the beginning of time, I didn't say that.
Jennifer Tate (36:57.138)
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (37:12.362)
Who told you that? Yeah, yeah.
Jennifer Tate (37:18.418)
Yeah, yeah. And so, you know, and I think people think, oh, I have to forgive myself, but I didn't do anything. Like it's not, it's not something you did anything. It is even of expectations, like hopes that you had, you know, that was a big one. It's like I was going to, my parents got divorced.
Melissa Lapin (37:26.022)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (37:30.713)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (37:38.446)
right after their 25th wedding anniversary. And I was like at 20, I think 20. So I was like, no, we were gonna be the couple that stayed together till we were old, we were not gonna get divorced, both of his parents had been divorced. I'm like, this is a generational something and this is stopping, no, this wasn't gonna be us. And so all of those expectations that I had for being that overcomer couple, I had to forgive myself for
Melissa Lapin (37:40.585)
Bye.
Melissa Lapin (37:48.048)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (37:52.888)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (38:07.44)
And thinking that I did something or let someone down, you know? Yeah, and just press into the truth that, no, no. It's move forward, quit looking backwards.
Melissa Lapin (38:17.709)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (38:22.092)
Yeah, so, um.
Yeah, I don't know. I think it's good. I don't know why we camped out on the divorce thing or whatever. I mean, I know I have. But I think it's... yeah. Well, yay for redemption. But, but yeah, so if you're out there listening, cut yourself some slack. And forgive yourself. Give yourself some grace. If, if you're in a rough marriage and
You're, you guys are talking divorce, you're thinking divorce.
it's not taboo, it's not a sin, it's not all these things that religion would make it. You know, but also I think there's so much of our society that's a throwaway society. You know, we throw away babies, we throw away all kinds of things because they're an inconvenience or they're too much work. And you know, if you have done everything
Jennifer Tate (39:16.671)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (39:29.592)
that you believe the Lord has told you to do, take another step, do another thing, you know? And it takes two. It takes two to dance. It really does. And...
Jennifer Tate (39:34.188)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (39:40.506)
It does. Yeah, it takes two and it takes work. It is work. It's, you know, and I think that's what I see. A lot of people, they just don't want, you know, they don't want, but yeah, that heart and heart too, though, that happens, you know, if people can't step into that forgiveness, you know, and yeah, but also think about, I'm just thinking about the woman at the well, like he sees, he saw her, you know.
Melissa Lapin (39:44.73)
It is, yeah.
Melissa Lapin (39:49.744)
Yeah, because it's hard. Yeah.
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (39:59.27)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (40:10.386)
And people want to be seen, you know, and just to think he sees you, he knows what you're going through. He's never left you. He's always been there with you in all the things, right? And so, yeah, just to step in that presence that he has and that understanding of, I didn't say that about you. I didn't put that on you.
Melissa Lapin (40:27.718)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (40:35.808)
Yeah. Just believe what you're hearing. That's good. Not the bad things. Because if it isn't good, it isn't God. You know, it's, it's don't, I think we have a hard time partnering with the accuser to ourselves, you know, and I think a lot of it is, is that, you know, Disney fairy tale.
Jennifer Tate (40:45.739)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (41:01.104)
you know, expectation of happily ever after. And, but it comes down to both people working on it, like you said, I've got to do me, they've got to do them, whether it's marriage or other kind of friendships, or, you know, whatever relationships, personal responsibility is the only way to be successful in it. Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (41:26.334)
Yeah, yeah. You know, I, yeah.
Melissa Lapin (41:30.34)
Yeah, yeah. And just believing what God says about you in that and owning that and not what the world puts on us.
Jennifer Tate (41:43.082)
Yeah, all of it. Yeah, you know, even going back to, like I shared at the beginning, is the labels placed on me as a child, you know, even think of the ones before you, you know, when you're born to a teenage mom, you know, it's like, oh, what was spoke over you even in the womb. And so when you think about things like that, it's like not taking on those labels throughout life.
Melissa Lapin (42:01.058)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (42:10.306)
And like there are so many nasty stories, but I hate when I see people who don't have a good relationship with a parent and don't get me wrong. Boundaries have to happen and it doesn't mean a good relationship does not mean And somebody may argue with me. It doesn't mean that they're in your life all the time or that you're talking to them every day. You have to use wisdom and you have to, you know,
Melissa Lapin (42:23.013)
For sure.
Melissa Lapin (42:31.14)
Yeah. Yep.
Jennifer Tate (42:38.154)
listen to the Lord when it comes to, okay, when is a good time to talk to that person and when is not a good time to talk to that person? You know, when, do you let them reach out to you or do you reach out to them? You know, and those are all boundaries in those relationships. But having that type of relationship where you're listening to the Lord, but you're also, you know, it's complete, incomplete forgiveness, where it's like, I'm not, there's no ill,
Melissa Lapin (42:43.816)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (42:52.037)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (43:03.932)
Mm-hmm.
Jennifer Tate (43:06.978)
feelings or will intent in those boundaries. They're just healthy boundaries so that you can be true to who the Lord created you to be. And then, I mean, I've had to do that multiple times. My dad is pre-Christian. We'll say that. And so we have a lot of good conversations about that's not truth. I don't know what that is you're saying. It's not truth. And literally like.
Melissa Lapin (43:10.356)
Mm-hmm. Sure.
Melissa Lapin (43:30.804)
Mm-hmm.
Jennifer Tate (43:35.33)
breaking death off of it. Like it's just been insane. But standing in that love and having that loving relationship with him, but in speaking the truth, but also those boundaries have to be in place too of like we're not having that conversation. Like that is not even, and that's a whole nother. Like I have all these little mini sub, don't we all? Sub stories, it's like, woo, okay. But again too, there's so much, so much to all of it. But.
Melissa Lapin (43:42.525)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (43:52.046)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (43:57.658)
Hehehe
Melissa Lapin (44:03.714)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (44:04.526)
standing in the truths of who our Father in Heaven say we are. You know, what does He say about us? Is that your truth? No, it's not. Okay, well, approve that. Are there any roots to it? There's not, it's a superficial, get it out, like weed it. And so.
Melissa Lapin (44:12.562)
Right.
Melissa Lapin (44:17.804)
Yeah, yeah. Well, and part of that too is that nobody throw any hate and don't be a Karen about what I'm gonna say. It's not about just memorizing scripture and throwing scripture out there because if just repeating scripture worked, we'd all be in a different place, especially us here in the South. Girl.
Jennifer Tate (44:29.166)
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
Jennifer Tate (44:37.069)
Right.
Melissa Lapin (44:47.544)
on the bumper stickers, on the roadside signs, like all the throwing out the scripture. It's about having a personal encounter because Fatina and Jesus met at a well when she went to get a drink of water.
Jennifer Tate (44:58.508)
Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (45:05.891)
Exactly.
Melissa Lapin (45:06.468)
right? She was not in synagogue. She was not under a tree praying. You know, it wasn't any of that. She was doing an everyday task and Jesus just kind of hijacked the moment for her and he became real. And I think that's what I want to leave everybody with is that it doesn't matter what you're going through. Um, it's about that every day.
Jennifer Tate (45:22.823)
Yeah, yeah.
Melissa Lapin (45:35.444)
conversation that you have. Again, I'm not talking about reading scripture. Can scripture prompt an encounter? Absolutely. Don't forsake the Bible. But the Bible does not take place of Jesus. You know, because to a lot of other cultures, the Bible is just a history book. Like literally, you step outside the United States and that Bible comes off the pedestal real quick.
Jennifer Tate (45:50.522)
Mmm.
Melissa Lapin (46:05.256)
You know, it is literally a history book. Jewish people read it. Muslim people read it. But it's a history book, right? And so I think we've gotten distracted by scripture and it's taken place of our own personal relationship with Jesus. And so my encouragement to you listening would be to
Maybe even close your scripture, close the Bible, and just ask, Jesus, what do you want to say to me? Because for some people, that's like a really weird, freaky idea, right? To actually have a verbal conversation with the Trinity. But I would encourage y'all to do that and see what he says and make that be your well moment and believe what it is you hear.
Jennifer Tate (46:53.73)
Thank you.
Melissa Lapin (47:01.456)
Because you have a sanctified imagination. You're not making stuff up and if it's good, it's God You know, even if he says I think you're pretty or her I think you're smart or you know the little things start there You know, he's not gonna give you the answers to the cosmos but Yeah, yeah, that's
Jennifer Tate (47:13.419)
Hahaha. Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (47:25.974)
Yeah, yeah, I agree a million percent with what you said, obviously. But you know, what we talked about earlier was you have to do the hard thing, right? You have to do it. She was carrying pails to get water. So she was going to get water. She's doing the hard thing. She was by herself. Somebody couldn't do her for her. She didn't have a girlfriend meet Jesus for her. She didn't have a mama meet Jesus for her. She didn't have her praying aunt meet Jesus for her.
Melissa Lapin (47:36.146)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (47:39.956)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (47:50.9)
Mm-mm. It's good. Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (47:53.322)
She personally met Jesus by herself doing the hard thing, doing the daily thing. And you know, that's what I love about life is co-laboring with the Lord in everything we do and you know, do it all as if we're doing it unto Him. Like we have that conversation going of, okay, how's this gonna play out, Lord? What's this gonna look like? And that's that seated and heavenly.
Melissa Lapin (47:58.744)
Yeah. Yup.
Jennifer Tate (48:13.698)
place is perspective where it's like, what's this gonna look like father? Okay, if I make this choice, and having that dialogue with him, but we have to do it ourselves. We have to have that personal time. And she got away from, right? She went to the well by herself. And like you said, there's so many reasons why she could have went at noon, but maybe she just didn't wanna deal with people. It's like, you know.
Melissa Lapin (48:18.376)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (48:23.409)
Yeah.
Melissa Lapin (48:36.148)
Uh huh. That or, you know, maybe she, maybe she was a laundress and she was going back for her second or third, you know, bucket of water of the day or what, we have no idea. And there's like 2000 years of assumptions around one woman. Bless her heart.
Jennifer Tate (48:50.189)
Exactly, yeah.
Jennifer Tate (48:55.954)
I know I believe he intentionally left that story open that way so that we can all because you can relate to it more right you can relate to you we can put ourself in that place of what was and so you know perhaps I just shared some internal stuff there yeah she wanted to go and no one else is there so that's why you know but you know but yeah as far you're better worker than me you're on your second load of laundry and I'm like she was making tea.
Melissa Lapin (49:04.131)
Mm-hmm.
Melissa Lapin (49:16.174)
You know?
Melissa Lapin (49:24.348)
You know, it is what it is. If she could have had a bath house, she, you know, who knows? We don't know. And we try to make so much of it when it's, yeah. Yeah.
Jennifer Tate (49:28.654)
I'm sorry.
Jennifer Tate (49:32.262)
Yeah, but yeah, that personal, personal time and relationship that you have to do yourself and she did and so I think that's key.
Melissa Lapin (49:40.55)
Yeah.
Yeah, for sure. Well, I think that's a good place to land.
Jennifer Tate (49:47.765)
Yay!
Melissa Lapin (49:47.884)
So in all of that. So thank you Jennifer for coming on and hanging out with me for this time and sharing your story and being vulnerable because it is hard. It's hard to you know put your story out there. You know for anybody interested her book will be a link to that will be in the show notes because we're going to promote that because everybody's story needs to
Melissa Lapin (50:17.858)
support my friend and yeah that's where we're gonna land for today so yeah thanks everybody for listening and catch you on the next episode
Jennifer Tate (50:24.482)
All right. Thank you.
